QueeenAl
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Fell so hard for this man, will never get up.
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Post by QueeenAl on Jan 25, 2015 5:53:56 GMT -5
Just got around to reading the thread, and feel I need to say something. I am by no means a Tommy fan, and find it totally understandable and in his best interest for Adam to move on, but fair is fair: Tommy can play the guitar just fine. If he learns a piece, he plays it well, and in addition to guitar he plays bass and even some piano. The guy is a musician that any group that is routinely playing the same thing over and over again, can use. 95 % of today's pop acts can work with such guitar skills just fine. In that one example, something is off with the instrument, not a example that shows Tommy's play. Watch here, to see what Tommy is actually capable of: Having said that, Tommy cannot improv and Adam needs that for his concerts. I also find that Tommy is often disengaged (not in the example above), and that this does impact his play or at least his ability to grow further. He also seems to like other music and so I think moving on is probably the right thing. But I surely wish him well, appreciate that he was (and presumably is) a loyal friend and truly have a problem understanding all the negativity thrown at Tommy not only on twitter, but also here. If Adam's band was weak in E2, and I agree that it was, I attribute that to two people. a) his musical director / keyboard player and b) his drummer. No band can sound tight, if the drummer is a mess, and keys was alright, but not great and no leadership. imo neither Ashley, nor Tommy are to blame for the sound not being tight, they did their part. If it is true what people here are suggesting, then I'd call it an amicable split and hope everyone can move on, and all is well. =============== Now, as far as putting a new group together, I actually think that Adam does need help getting it right. Adam will want to be involved of course, because in the end he needs to get along with everyone at a minimum and optimally nothing is more wonderful than seeing a band that enjoys themselves and feeds off of each other and forms a tight group, but I know that this is asking for a lot for a band just thrown together to support a solo artist. Such things have to evolve with good fortune, but still, we can always hope. But essential is that when it comes to the musicianship, I hope Adam makes use of his many contacts to evaluate the available talent. THAT ^^^^ Right .. if I ever need something said I'll just call you ... is that ok with you?
Adding to that, I am by all means a Tommy fan, and he is quite fun and has depths and strange bends and I really can't figure him out yet (apart from that, I know he is the one of the most loyal ond closemouthed of Adams people).
The closer I look I do not see how he ever ended up in Adam's band (apart from "the pretty", but I am puzzled that Adam would be so shallow - maybe a joint love of blues was a "glue" but Adam did not really develop in that direction since), but I am looking forward to see where life takes him. Good places, hopefully ...
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bobo
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Post by bobo on Jan 25, 2015 9:22:34 GMT -5
well if we are going down that line lets just have the best h ttp://youtu.be/wz1VwVozwjE Wow! Lilly...that guy was fascinating to listen to and watch. YEAH ! WOW! He's Swedish, by the way....  |
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Post by cassie on Jan 25, 2015 13:37:31 GMT -5
I know this is a dead thread, but this keeps running around in my head, so...
What Adam needs is top notch MUSICIANS to back him. I have never sat down with TJR and jammed, I have never watched him practice or rehearse, but from what I have seen and heard, he is a technician rather than a musician. Yes, if you show him how to play a song, give him the chords, and sit him down with a guitar and several hours to work on it, he can LEARN to play it competently.
Let's face it. Most of us who play an instrument are technicians. Then you have people like my sister who are amazing musicians. She recently went to Florida to escape the winter blizzards and sat in with a local rock/pop/country band who needed a keyboard player. They were concerned how she would fit in, as she hadn't had time to learn their repertoire. Worse than that, they didn't even have "cheat sheets" or charts with an outline of lyrics and chording. She assured them she would be fine.
Some of their numbers were songs she had played before some time in the forty plus years she has been gigging. Others she had heard on the radio at some point. All she needed was to know the key they played in, and she could play with them. The songs she had not heard before? Those took the guys playing the song thru once or twice before she had it down. Country songs? All it took was one verse and she was playing along with them.
I contrast that with TJR's playing of Change is Gonna Come. He must have heard it before. It is an anthem for civil rights. But even if he hadn't, all he had to do was follow Monte's chording which he could see and hear, and then play the base of the chord on the bass. (For example, a G chord, contains the notes G, B and D. The base of the chord is G. 90% of the time the bass guitar is playing the base of the chord or one of the other notes in it. As long as TJ did that he was golden. He couldn't.)
Great musicians can create, modify and change songs. You've got a cold tonight and can't hit the high notes? No problem. We will just drop the key a bit. Instead of G, how about F? Still too high? How about Eb? It's Reggae night? No problem. WLL with a reggae beat coming up. When Adam tried that on the GNT stop in Atlanta, he tried directing TJ to play the beat he wanted, and TJ didn't do it. Adam actually walked over to him and pounded the beat on his chest, but TJ never picked it up.
When TJ was playing guitar for Adam's whistle stop radio station promo tour and the audience wanted another number, he couldn't play it, even if he had played it previously on the bass. He had to go back to the hotel or whatever, and learn the song. "Well, of course. He never played the guitar part before," you say.
That's what a TECHNICIAN does. A talented MUSICIAN can improvise the song on the spot. Not note for note perfect, but enjoyably. Think about it. You've been to a piano bar where people just call out songs to hear, right? Or send a note with a tip if they will play "My Sharona"? My sister would do that every gig. The only problem was she didn't know the words. Now, with a smart phone and the internet, she can call up lyrics and sing as well as play the piece.
There is nothing wrong with good technicians. They give us a good night's entertainment. Someone with the musicality and the incredible instrument like Adam, tho', deserves top notch musicians and I hope he gets them next time around.
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taumbu
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Post by taumbu on Jan 25, 2015 13:45:18 GMT -5
I know this is a dead thread, but this keeps running around in my head, so... What Adam needs is top notch MUSICIANS to back him. I have never sat down with TJR and jammed, I have never watched him practice or rehearse, but from what I have seen and heard, he is a technician rather than a musician. Yes, if you show him how to play a song, give him the chords, and sit him down with a guitar and several hours to work on it, he can LEARN to play it competently. Let's face it. Most of us who play an instrument are technicians. Then you have people like my sister who are amazing musicians. She recently went to Florida to escape the winter blizzards and sat in with a local rock/pop/country band who needed a keyboard player. They were concerned how she would fit in, as she hadn't had time to learn their repertoire. Worse than that, they didn't even have "cheat sheets" or charts with an outline of lyrics and chording. She assured them she would be fine. Some of their numbers were songs she had played before some time in the forty plus years she has been gigging. Others she had heard on the radio at some point. All she needed was to know the key they played in, and she could play with them. The songs she had not heard before? Those took the guys playing the song thru once or twice before she had it down. Country songs? All it took was one verse and she was playing along with them. I contrast that with TJR's playing of Change is Gonna Come. He must have heard it before. It is an anthem for civil rights. But even if he hadn't, all he had to do was follow Monte's chording which he could see and hear, and then play the base of the chord on the bass. (For example, a G chord, contains the notes G, B and D. The base of the chord is G. 90% of the time the bass guitar is playing the base of the chord or one of the other notes in it. As long as TJ did that he was golden. He couldn't.) Great musicians can create, modify and change songs. You've got a cold tonight and can't hit the high notes? No problem. We will just drop the key a bit. Instead of G, how about F? Still too high? How about Eb? It's Reggae night? No problem. WLL with a reggae beat coming up. When Adam tried that on the GNT stop in Atlanta, he tried directing TJ to play the beat he wanted, and TJ didn't do it. Adam actually walked over to him and pounded the beat on his chest, but TJ never picked it up. When TJ was playing guitar for Adam's whistle stop radio station promo tour and the audience wanted another number, he couldn't play it, even if he had played it previously on the bass. He had to go back to the hotel or whatever, and learn the song. "Well, of course. He never played the guitar part before," you say. That's what a TECHNICIAN does. A talented MUSICIAN can improvise the song on the spot. Not note for note perfect, but enjoyably. Think about it. You've been to a piano bar where people just call out songs to hear, right? Or send a note with a tip if they will play "My Sharona"? My sister would do that every gig. The only problem was she didn't know the words. Now, with a smart phone and the internet, she can call up lyrics and sing as well as play the piece. There is nothing wrong with good technicians. They give us a good night's entertainment. Someone with the musicality and the incredible instrument like Adam, tho', deserves top notch musicians and I hope he gets them next time around. I totally agree with you Cassie. I'll never forget when my DH went with me to one of Adam's concerts. He knows a lot about music and had heard Adam's albums. But when he saw Adam live, he turned to me and said " now there's a real musician." |
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nic42
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Ni l'un ni l'autre, je suis, j'étais et resterai moi
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Post by nic42 on Jan 25, 2015 15:05:58 GMT -5
I know this is a dead thread, but this keeps running around in my head, so... What Adam needs is top notch MUSICIANS to back him. I have never sat down with TJR and jammed, I have never watched him practice or rehearse, but from what I have seen and heard, he is a technician rather than a musician. Yes, if you show him how to play a song, give him the chords, and sit him down with a guitar and several hours to work on it, he can LEARN to play it competently. Let's face it. Most of us who play an instrument are technicians. Then you have people like my sister who are amazing musicians. She recently went to Florida to escape the winter blizzards and sat in with a local rock/pop/country band who needed a keyboard player. They were concerned how she would fit in, as she hadn't had time to learn their repertoire. Worse than that, they didn't even have "cheat sheets" or charts with an outline of lyrics and chording. She assured them she would be fine. Some of their numbers were songs she had played before some time in the forty plus years she has been gigging. Others she had heard on the radio at some point. All she needed was to know the key they played in, and she could play with them. The songs she had not heard before? Those took the guys playing the song thru once or twice before she had it down. Country songs? All it took was one verse and she was playing along with them. I contrast that with TJR's playing of Change is Gonna Come. He must have heard it before. It is an anthem for civil rights. But even if he hadn't, all he had to do was follow Monte's chording which he could see and hear, and then play the base of the chord on the bass. (For example, a G chord, contains the notes G, B and D. The base of the chord is G. 90% of the time the bass guitar is playing the base of the chord or one of the other notes in it. As long as TJ did that he was golden. He couldn't.) Great musicians can create, modify and change songs. You've got a cold tonight and can't hit the high notes? No problem. We will just drop the key a bit. Instead of G, how about F? Still too high? How about Eb? It's Reggae night? No problem. WLL with a reggae beat coming up. When Adam tried that on the GNT stop in Atlanta, he tried directing TJ to play the beat he wanted, and TJ didn't do it. Adam actually walked over to him and pounded the beat on his chest, but TJ never picked it up. When TJ was playing guitar for Adam's whistle stop radio station promo tour and the audience wanted another number, he couldn't play it, even if he had played it previously on the bass. He had to go back to the hotel or whatever, and learn the song. "Well, of course. He never played the guitar part before," you say. That's what a TECHNICIAN does. A talented MUSICIAN can improvise the song on the spot. Not note for note perfect, but enjoyably. Think about it. You've been to a piano bar where people just call out songs to hear, right? Or send a note with a tip if they will play "My Sharona"? My sister would do that every gig. The only problem was she didn't know the words. Now, with a smart phone and the internet, she can call up lyrics and sing as well as play the piece. There is nothing wrong with good technicians. They give us a good night's entertainment. Someone with the musicality and the incredible instrument like Adam, tho', deserves top notch musicians and I hope he gets them next time around. Yes Cassie! It is a big difference. For me I encountered it a lot at university. I studied philosophy, and a lot of the people that I met thought we were (or were becoming) philosophers. We weren't. I like to call it philosophology. And that's what I was. I know how to write a well thought out piece, and occasionally I could make a new connection, but doesn't have the spark, the thinking, the inspiration, the learning and then letting go because you can rise above that learning and make something new. It is the difference between Technicians and Artists. Thank you. Wishing for Adam to have many artists to travel together with on his road, wherever he may be going. |
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Holst
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Post by Holst on Jan 25, 2015 21:08:16 GMT -5
I know this is a dead thread, but this keeps running around in my head, so... What Adam needs is top notch MUSICIANS to back him. I have never sat down with TJR and jammed, I have never watched him practice or rehearse, but from what I have seen and heard, he is a technician rather than a musician. Yes, if you show him how to play a song, give him the chords, and sit him down with a guitar and several hours to work on it, he can LEARN to play it competently. Let's face it. Most of us who play an instrument are technicians. Then you have people like my sister who are amazing musicians. She recently went to Florida to escape the winter blizzards and sat in with a local rock/pop/country band who needed a keyboard player. They were concerned how she would fit in, as she hadn't had time to learn their repertoire. Worse than that, they didn't even have "cheat sheets" or charts with an outline of lyrics and chording. She assured them she would be fine. Some of their numbers were songs she had played before some time in the forty plus years she has been gigging. Others she had heard on the radio at some point. All she needed was to know the key they played in, and she could play with them. The songs she had not heard before? Those took the guys playing the song thru once or twice before she had it down. Country songs? All it took was one verse and she was playing along with them. I contrast that with TJR's playing of Change is Gonna Come. He must have heard it before. It is an anthem for civil rights. But even if he hadn't, all he had to do was follow Monte's chording which he could see and hear, and then play the base of the chord on the bass. (For example, a G chord, contains the notes G, B and D. The base of the chord is G. 90% of the time the bass guitar is playing the base of the chord or one of the other notes in it. As long as TJ did that he was golden. He couldn't.) Great musicians can create, modify and change songs. You've got a cold tonight and can't hit the high notes? No problem. We will just drop the key a bit. Instead of G, how about F? Still too high? How about Eb? It's Reggae night? No problem. WLL with a reggae beat coming up. When Adam tried that on the GNT stop in Atlanta, he tried directing TJ to play the beat he wanted, and TJ didn't do it. Adam actually walked over to him and pounded the beat on his chest, but TJ never picked it up. When TJ was playing guitar for Adam's whistle stop radio station promo tour and the audience wanted another number, he couldn't play it, even if he had played it previously on the bass. He had to go back to the hotel or whatever, and learn the song. "Well, of course. He never played the guitar part before," you say. That's what a TECHNICIAN does. A talented MUSICIAN can improvise the song on the spot. Not note for note perfect, but enjoyably. Think about it. You've been to a piano bar where people just call out songs to hear, right? Or send a note with a tip if they will play "My Sharona"? My sister would do that every gig. The only problem was she didn't know the words. Now, with a smart phone and the internet, she can call up lyrics and sing as well as play the piece. There is nothing wrong with good technicians. They give us a good night's entertainment. Someone with the musicality and the incredible instrument like Adam, tho', deserves top notch musicians and I hope he gets them next time around. Cassie, I'm going to disagree with you a bit. I'm not going to address TJ's musicianship. But it sounds like you are saying that a person can't be a talented musician without being able to improvise. I can't quite wrap my head around that. Certainly many excellent musicians can (even classical) can improvise. I can't believe the everyone else is just a technician. |
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Post by cassie on Jan 25, 2015 21:48:48 GMT -5
I know this is a dead thread, but this keeps running around in my head, so... What Adam needs is top notch MUSICIANS to back him. I have never sat down with TJR and jammed, I have never watched him practice or rehearse, but from what I have seen and heard, he is a technician rather than a musician. Yes, if you show him how to play a song, give him the chords, and sit him down with a guitar and several hours to work on it, he can LEARN to play it competently. Let's face it. Most of us who play an instrument are technicians. Then you have people like my sister who are amazing musicians. She recently went to Florida to escape the winter blizzards and sat in with a local rock/pop/country band who needed a keyboard player. They were concerned how she would fit in, as she hadn't had time to learn their repertoire. Worse than that, they didn't even have "cheat sheets" or charts with an outline of lyrics and chording. She assured them she would be fine. Some of their numbers were songs she had played before some time in the forty plus years she has been gigging. Others she had heard on the radio at some point. All she needed was to know the key they played in, and she could play with them. The songs she had not heard before? Those took the guys playing the song thru once or twice before she had it down. Country songs? All it took was one verse and she was playing along with them. I contrast that with TJR's playing of Change is Gonna Come. He must have heard it before. It is an anthem for civil rights. But even if he hadn't, all he had to do was follow Monte's chording which he could see and hear, and then play the base of the chord on the bass. (For example, a G chord, contains the notes G, B and D. The base of the chord is G. 90% of the time the bass guitar is playing the base of the chord or one of the other notes in it. As long as TJ did that he was golden. He couldn't.) Great musicians can create, modify and change songs. You've got a cold tonight and can't hit the high notes? No problem. We will just drop the key a bit. Instead of G, how about F? Still too high? How about Eb? It's Reggae night? No problem. WLL with a reggae beat coming up. When Adam tried that on the GNT stop in Atlanta, he tried directing TJ to play the beat he wanted, and TJ didn't do it. Adam actually walked over to him and pounded the beat on his chest, but TJ never picked it up. When TJ was playing guitar for Adam's whistle stop radio station promo tour and the audience wanted another number, he couldn't play it, even if he had played it previously on the bass. He had to go back to the hotel or whatever, and learn the song. "Well, of course. He never played the guitar part before," you say. That's what a TECHNICIAN does. A talented MUSICIAN can improvise the song on the spot. Not note for note perfect, but enjoyably. Think about it. You've been to a piano bar where people just call out songs to hear, right? Or send a note with a tip if they will play "My Sharona"? My sister would do that every gig. The only problem was she didn't know the words. Now, with a smart phone and the internet, she can call up lyrics and sing as well as play the piece. There is nothing wrong with good technicians. They give us a good night's entertainment. Someone with the musicality and the incredible instrument like Adam, tho', deserves top notch musicians and I hope he gets them next time around. Cassie, I'm going to disagree with you a bit. I'm not going to address TJ's musicianship. But it sounds like you are saying that a person can't be a talented musician without being able to improvise. I can't quite wrap my head around that. Certainly many excellent musicians can (even classical) can improvise. I can't believe the everyone else is just a technician. I don't think we disagree. Certainly not all talented musicians are able to improvise. Certain genres emphasize that, and musicians who train in that genre learn how to jam, improvise, and riff. In other genres, not so much. I was using that as an example. Perhaps not a good one. Since you play violin, what would you use as an example of the difference between a violin technician and an artist? I am thinking that a technician may be able to study a piece of music, practice it for hours and perform it note for note. But the music doesn't soar, doesn't sing, has no soul. An artist on the violin might be able to look at a piece of music and hear it in her head. Imagine how it sounds, where it crescendos, where the apex point of the piece is, etc. She might not be able to play it perfectly upon first reading, but, once it is in her fingers, she can make that piece of music touch the listener. Maybe that is no better an example. I don't think we disagree about artistry/musicianship vs. technical ability or lack thereof. |
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Post by Jablea on Jan 25, 2015 23:19:03 GMT -5
Cassie, I'm going to disagree with you a bit. I'm not going to address TJ's musicianship. But it sounds like you are saying that a person can't be a talented musician without being able to improvise. I can't quite wrap my head around that. Certainly many excellent musicians can (even classical) can improvise. I can't believe the everyone else is just a technician. I don't think we disagree. Certainly not all talented musicians are able to improvise. Certain genres emphasize that, and musicians who train in that genre learn how to jam, improvise, and riff. In other genres, not so much. I was using that as an example. Perhaps not a good one. Since you play violin, what would you use as an example of the difference between a violin technician and an artist? I am thinking that a technician may be able to study a piece of music, practice it for hours and perform it note for note. But the music doesn't soar, doesn't sing, has no soul. An artist on the violin might be able to look at a piece of music and hear it in her head. Imagine how it sounds, where it crescendos, where the apex point of the piece is, etc. She might not be able to play it perfectly upon first reading, but, once it is in her fingers, she can make that piece of music touch the listener. Maybe that is no better an example. I don't think we disagree about artistry/musicianship vs. technical ability or lack thereof. I've had two books for 35 years (since my first day of college) and that since knowing Adam I've also always associated with him. I reread them almost every year. The first is Dragon Song, sequeled with Dragon Singer. Both by Anne McCafferty, a fantasy fiction writer, and part of her Dragons of Pern series. A young girl is taken under tutelage and taught to help play the teaching songs. When her mentor dies she is punished by her father by not playing the teaching songs note by note (she improvised) and circumstances happen such that music is forbidden to her because she is a girl. The story continues in the sequel where musicianship is felt thru her eyes much as you are discussing now. If you haven't had the chance to read this small series where music cannot be denied I urge you to do so. In fact I think I'm going to put down my Dirk Pitt mystery novel and go soak myself in Dragon Song & Dragon Singer. I fell in love with them just like I did with Adam. www.amazon.com/Dragonsong-Harper-Hall-Trilogy-Book/dp/0689860080 |
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Post by cassie on Jan 26, 2015 0:30:17 GMT -5
I don't think we disagree. Certainly not all talented musicians are able to improvise. Certain genres emphasize that, and musicians who train in that genre learn how to jam, improvise, and riff. In other genres, not so much. I was using that as an example. Perhaps not a good one. Since you play violin, what would you use as an example of the difference between a violin technician and an artist? I am thinking that a technician may be able to study a piece of music, practice it for hours and perform it note for note. But the music doesn't soar, doesn't sing, has no soul. An artist on the violin might be able to look at a piece of music and hear it in her head. Imagine how it sounds, where it crescendos, where the apex point of the piece is, etc. She might not be able to play it perfectly upon first reading, but, once it is in her fingers, she can make that piece of music touch the listener. Maybe that is no better an example. I don't think we disagree about artistry/musicianship vs. technical ability or lack thereof. I've had two books for 35 years (since my first day of college) and that since knowing Adam I've also always associated with him. I reread them almost every year. The first is Dragon Song, sequeled with Dragon Singer. Both by Anne McCafferty, a fantasy fiction writer, and part of her Dragons of Pern series. A young girl is taken under tutelage and taught to help play the teaching songs. When her mentor dies she is punished by her father by not playing the teaching songs note by note (she improvised) and circumstances happen such that music is forbidden to her because she is a girl. The story continues in the sequel where musicianship is felt thru her eyes much as you are discussing now. If you haven't had the chance to read this small series where music cannot be denied I urge you to do so. In fact I think I'm going to put down my Dirk Pitt mystery novel and go soak myself in Dragon Song & Dragon Singer. I fell in love with them just like I did with Adam. www.amazon.com/Dragonsong-Harper-Hall-Trilogy-Book/dp/0689860080I love that early series. I also have the books, tho' I have to admit they are probably the third or fourth copy I've had to replace. I never associated them with Adam before now, but after your mention, probably will from now on. |
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