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Post by nannygoat on Nov 21, 2018 11:47:20 GMT -5
I have a few things to say about discussing Adam's private life. First, I'm not much interested in his private life because it is predictable and ordinary. His public professional life is far more interesting, and since he spends more time onstage or on the record than off, there is plenty enough to talk about. In his own words, it's the best expression of who he really is. Second, I cringe every time I see that he is being judged against biased standards. Those who judge him for the age of those he dates: why did you not speak up when you learned that Roger Taylor's wife is 23 years younger? Or when David Foster married Katharine McPhee? Are you also appalled at the recent marriage of Nick Jonas and Priyanka Chopra? Meanwhile, Elton John's husband is 15 years younger and they have been together 25 years. Statistically, the average couple span for homosexuals is longer and more stable than for heterosexuals. Yet legal-age young adult gay males are construed as bad risks. Older gay males who date them are dubbed "perverts." Did you feel the same way when Ellen Degeneres "perverted" Anne Heche, or dated her current wife, Portia, who is 15 years younger? Third, It seems there is not only a double standard for Adam that references the madonna/whore complex, but also the expectation that Adam's private life should follow some sort of normative developed by heterosexuals for heterosexuals. This is ironic since the antiquated normatives imposed on Western heterosexual relationships are implicated in high divorce rates, spousal violence, depression, and substance abuse. Why would Adam's fans want to impose on him normatives that are deeply flawed and may be contributing to the current gun violence destroying society? In the years that Adam has mindfully refrained from commitment to relationships doomed to fail because his professional life is transient and unstable, how many divorces and rehabs have you endured among your own? How many mass shootings with roots in toxic masculinity that is exacerbated by these double standards? Lastly, the more that fans impose themselves into his and his friends' private lives, the harder they will work to shut fans out. Case in point: Adam appears to be relying more on assistants to post on his public social media accounts. What he does post himself is predictable: "Hello Cleveland!", promotional back-scratching, or acknowledging his friends. When he finally does open up, as with tweets about NRA, he is punished for it by fandom trolls. When he does the obligatory live chat he only chooses the same questions he's answered 101 times before. In other words, fans will never get him to say or do anything that compromises his privacy or personal convictions. He is boring you on purpose. Get the hint already. Isn't there enough Adam to talk about without reinforcing personal biases, based on flawed normatives, and contributing to dangerous double standards? Maybe there should be a rule here that you can discuss and pass judgment on Adam's private life only after revealing all the same sordid details about your own, so we can all decide together if you're doing it right. /rant Well said. I am sure there are those that will take offense to the tone, but I agree we have a double standard. As much as we want AL to be the unique individual that he is, many are constantly trying to impose society's 'norms' on him.
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mszue
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Post by mszue on Nov 21, 2018 12:11:27 GMT -5
I have a few things to say about discussing Adam's private life. First, I'm not much interested in his private life because it is predictable and ordinary. His public professional life is far more interesting, and since he spends more time onstage or on the record than off, there is plenty enough to talk about. In his own words, it's the best expression of who he really is. Second, I cringe every time I see that he is being judged against biased standards. Those who judge him for the age of those he dates: why did you not speak up when you learned that Roger Taylor's wife is 23 years younger? Or when David Foster married Katharine McPhee? Are you also appalled at the recent marriage of Nick Jonas and Priyanka Chopra? Meanwhile, Elton John's husband is 15 years younger and they have been together 25 years. Statistically, the average couple span for homosexuals is longer and more stable than for heterosexuals. Yet legal-age young adult gay males are construed as bad risks. Older gay males who date them are dubbed "perverts." Did you feel the same way when Ellen Degeneres "perverted" Anne Heche, or dated her current wife, Portia, who is 15 years younger? Third, It seems there is not only a double standard for Adam that references the madonna/whore complex, but also the expectation that Adam's private life should follow some sort of normative developed by heterosexuals for heterosexuals. This is ironic since the antiquated normatives imposed on Western heterosexual relationships are implicated in high divorce rates, spousal violence, depression, and substance abuse. Why would Adam's fans want to impose on him normatives that are deeply flawed and may be contributing to the current gun violence destroying society? In the years that Adam has mindfully refrained from commitment to relationships doomed to fail because his professional life is transient and unstable, how many divorces and rehabs have you endured among your own? How many mass shootings with roots in toxic masculinity that is exacerbated by these double standards? Lastly, the more that fans impose themselves into his and his friends' private lives, the harder they will work to shut fans out. Case in point: Adam appears to be relying more on assistants to post on his public social media accounts. What he does post himself is predictable: "Hello Cleveland!", promotional back-scratching, or acknowledging his friends. When he finally does open up, as with tweets about NRA, he is punished for it by fandom trolls. When he does the obligatory live chat he only chooses the same questions he's answered 101 times before. In other words, fans will never get him to say or do anything that compromises his privacy or personal convictions. He is boring you on purpose. Get the hint already. Isn't there enough Adam to talk about without reinforcing personal biases, based on flawed normatives, and contributing to dangerous double standards? Maybe there should be a rule here that you can discuss and pass judgment on Adam's private life only after revealing all the same sordid details about your own, so we can all decide together if you're doing it right. /rant Well said. I am sure there are those that will take offense to the tone, but I agree we have a double standard. As much as we want AL to be the unique individual that he is, many are constantly trying to impose society's 'norms' on him. We are all 'unique individuals' and as such, are all subject to the same society norms. Can't claim equal rights without allowing 'others' that same right. If we are not to make assumptions about gay men then they also must put the money where the mouth is and not make erroneous assumptions and stereotype fans...and on this site, a predominance of women...as owned by the 'mothering' term. I fear dear friends that our 'shy and nervous' friend has decided to mansplain the situation to us and we are sitting here smiling and admitting he has a good point! Yes the points are good but the assumptions are unkind, untrue to a large degree, and patronizing. Hiding out in the backrooms of a forum and then using that anonymity and experience to feel free to verbally beat up on us does not seem so different from fishing around on another person's facebook or instagram...and then meating on them. I don't like either... No need to post if you do not wish...of course...not everyone is an opinionated mouthy thing like me...and I totally respect that. But I do not like this....grrr....sure woke me up and chased me off the wrong side of the bed. sigh........
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SophieB
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Post by SophieB on Nov 21, 2018 12:12:02 GMT -5
Whatever else, I am deeply saddened by the loss of @graciejane - both to Atop and perhaps to the fandom as a whole.
She was one of my favourite posters; she contributed so much of interest and brought personality and a touch of snarky realism that almost always resonated with me.
I hope she'll come back but somehow...
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Post by skaschep on Nov 21, 2018 12:26:12 GMT -5
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Post by skaschep on Nov 21, 2018 12:27:24 GMT -5
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Post by bamafan on Nov 21, 2018 12:29:59 GMT -5
Queen @queenwillrock #ANightattheOpera was released 43 years ago today! 🎂 What's your favourite track? I see that I went to bed last night and missed the dust-up. I think someone has probably already said anything I could think of to say so I will just leave it. NOW, about this tweet which is probably JUST a Happy Birthday tweet BUT in the interest of conspiracy theorists everywhere COULD this be a hint at the direction of the next tour ?!?!? Adam ... opera .... Adam ... opera maybe I should review the album's track list before making outlandish suggestions .... nahI just looked up the track list. Bohemian Rhapsody is on there.....maybe a little more emphasis on that because of the movie, etc. You're my best Friend is on there.....that's a pretty song...would love that included. Im in Love w my Car on there...Love of my life. There are a few songs I've never listened to.
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Post by skaschep on Nov 21, 2018 12:30:49 GMT -5
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Post by nightowl on Nov 21, 2018 12:36:23 GMT -5
I see that I went to bed last night and missed the dust-up. I think someone has probably already said anything I could think of to say so I will just leave it. NOW, about this tweet which is probably JUST a Happy Birthday tweet BUT in the interest of conspiracy theorists everywhere COULD this be a hint at the direction of the next tour ?!?!? Adam ... opera .... Adam ... opera maybe I should review the album's track list before making outlandish suggestions .... nahI just looked up the track list. Bohemian Rhapsody is on there.....maybe a little more emphasis on that because of the movie, etc. You're my best Friend is on there.....that's a pretty song...would love that included. Im in Love w my Car on there...Love of my life. There are a few songs I've never listened to. That album is THE album for many Queen fans. That was Queen’s breakthrough into the business. It’s the only album mentioned in the film as well. I don’t think, that post has a special message. Just that this very important album has its anniversary. But you never know. edit: I checked the trackList again. No. They play BoRhap, Love of my life, I‘m in love with my car and God save the Queen already and did 39 before. The only song, that I see, that could be included, is indeed You‘re my best friend. The rest isn’t that interesting...so to say. 😉 That one new song wouldn’t validate a show based on that album. I mean, these last tours included more of that album than „News of the World“, the album they celebrated... edit 2: While we are talking about it: Next year is the 30th anniversary of „The Miracle“. Now that would be a great album to base a show on. Some of these singles were big hits, but never performed live due to Freddie being already sick, when it came out.
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Post by lurleene on Nov 21, 2018 12:49:45 GMT -5
Adam is a single man. He is only 36 so not old. If he dates someone younger so what? Stars do that all the time. Even non-stars. Some were acting as if he has been dating underage teens. I agree with MM that those type of charges can be harmful and picked up to hurt Adam. It seems fun to some, I guess but why? Not speaking about Javi, but often Adam will take a picture with someone and right away it is implied that he is sleeping with them. If you don't know that to be the case, why say it? If he likes a post of someone attractive, it is implied that it is because he is on the hunt. Even if you think that, why say it if you don't know? Calling young adult gay men boys as if they are prey. So maybe some of these actions appear homophobic because it might not be the first thought if Adam were straight. When I was young and single I dated. As a straight female in the corporate world, sometimes I dated older much more successful men. Other than people being nosey and trying to get into my business (annoying), no one painted those men as perverts. So yes, there is a double standard and a tendency by some (not all) to act as if Adam being gay means he is not doing what others have done until they find that special person. Most likely you are never going to find them if you stick with the familiar (old relationships that no longer work) and close yourself off from different experiences. Being gay does not change that or make it completely different. I don't think anyone was saying Adam's personal life is off limits. But it should be treated with some level of respect and not as sport or entertainment for fans. He is a public figure but he is also a real live man and that is not an excuse to be overly intrusive of his private life. Most of us are fans of his talent and good looks and being gay is only part of who he is. I personally have little interest in what his friends are doing or which posts he likes but I understand that others do. The public sometimes act as if Adam's sexuality is the only thing of importance. So I did not take offense to MM's comment. Didn't see them as pointing the finger at everyone but asking us to be aware. If someone is no longer a fan of Adam's, and only here to criticize him or make unfounded and potentially harmful allegations, it is okay if they move on, imo. We don't always agree on everything but we should be fans who at least try to support him when we can.
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Post by willowgarden on Nov 21, 2018 12:50:18 GMT -5
As I assume some others do here, I am also active on another fan Adam fan site along with this one. There has been recent strife on that site, too. I could be wrong, but sometimes there are people who go to different sites and try to stir up trouble. If that is the case here, I am sorry to hear it. I will miss Graciejane. She has been good member here and I hope she returned. None of this is Adam's fault. If we at Atop are victims of a common poster who posts elsewhere, I feel very bad about it. I haven't participated much in this recent conversation. I hope we can move on and fill the mood with some fun and optimism again. As probably the only one here who has actually met Mad Max, I can attest that she is no troll. She just has her opinion. Perhaps more strongly stated than what we are used to in here. Her background is interesting and I hope we will get to hear some of it when she is ready to share some of it.
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