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Post by LindaG23 on Dec 11, 2015 23:30:31 GMT -5
I really do see your point Q3, but I do think 18 yr old girls would have loved singing Shady in the car on the way home - Turn it up, turn it up, turn it way up, don't stop the beat. And if I go by my three nieces, trouble is what they want. Lyrics aside, Shady is a funk-soul dance song just like Uptown Funk and listeners were ready for it. The song was serviced to radio as well as being picked up on streaming media. It got promo just like any other single, with the benefit of having Bruno Mars involved which gave it immediate visibility. Shady released on the original album timeline when everyone was really interested in what Adam would produce and before the album was corrupted by a late weird release of BTIKM, just might have hit that same sweet spot.
And as far as songs being tested, we have to remember who was testing those songs. RCA was not going to give Adam a sexy dance song, just too plain scared. We will never know unless he tells us what Adam would have chosen for a first single, my guess would be Trespassing, but never BTIKM or NCOE. I think he has made that abundantly clear.
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Post by Q3 on Dec 11, 2015 23:44:07 GMT -5
I would say the same one that made Uptown Funk such a colossal hit. But Uptown Funk is 2015. And the Robin Thicke thing hit in 2014? Or late 2013? Shady was at least a year ahead of its time. Unfortunately. I don't think "Shady" would have been a hit single in 2012, 2013, 2014 or 2015. The live performance is fun, it is an excellent album track, but nothing indicates it is anything more than a fan favorite. If it was something more (like Cuckoo and Runnin') it would have more streams and more iTunes sales. Here are the US iTunes numbers for "Shady": It is not in the Top 100 Adam tracks on iTunes (based on popularity bars). It is the #8 of 15 tracks on the Trespassing Deluxe Album (based on popularity bars). [It is close to tied with PTL.] Non-singles that are above it in sales: Cuckoo, Runnin', OOL, Underneath -- plus the 3 singles BTIKM, NCOE, Trespassing. I sort of wish I had not looked. My personal favorite track from the album is #15 -- the other Lambert-Mendez-Sparro collaboration, "Broken English." I am probably the only one here who loves that song and plays it regularly.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2015 0:02:42 GMT -5
Hindsight really is 20/20. I understand the interest and fun in speculation - esp why not Shady. But one thing to remember - for the sake of sound critical reasoning and peaceful coexistence - is that no one knows 'what would have happened if...' It would have been a hit if and it could never have been a hit because are all theoretical and involve so many factors - known and unknown/unknowable. Look at the range of opinion among hardcore fans about the single selections for TOH -- and label execs face the same variations in taste and market factors but generally with more data and experience (and the pressure to turn a profit).
Could Shady have been a radio hit at the time of Trespassing's release? Maybe, but it would have taken very creative marketing and one or more big 'boost the signal' opportunities (movie, tv, commercial placement or the right tv performance(s)).
Blurred Lines startled a lot of people when radio really picked it up -- a singer with not much of a pop track record and a very retro sounding song. See wiki and related articles - everyone involved recognized the challenge. wiki cites comments by Thicke's mgr claiming credit for the strategy of creating a video so controversial the song would get played - a foot in the radio door - for that reason alone. There's less documentation but that was clearly the same thinking in adding T.I. and his verses - to tack on (controversial) rap verses to a retro r&b song to give it more contemporary edge and bring in T.I.'s urban audience -- to make it more familiar to radio. this groundwork had been laid for the voice performance (which happened because of yet more specific factors).
Uptown Funk - Read anything about Mark Ronson writing Uptown Funk and none of it was easy. Ronson is great but Bruno has a greater genius for hooks and is as likable to the pop listening public as Thicke is not - ha. Bruno had already leveraged his mainstream pop success (as songwriter and performer) to move towards a more retro aesthetic and sound per his own taste. Without Bruno's adds to the song (like his vocal line that nails the bottom of the song) and especially his 'bankability' as a pop star, it is unlikely the song would have just detonated the way it did - streaming or no. Just as some actors can open pretty much any genre of film - Bruno was in that position for UF - and it is pure earworm. (Group dances, school performances, you tube covers, dude on treadmill (that was impressive), Glee - really it just needed a toe in the door.)
So why not Shady? I personally am glad that Adam and his mgmt did not use the (imo) unsavory techniques that Thicke and company used. And while Blurred Lines remains catchy - Thicke was tainted by backlash against the song- instead his subsequent personal behavior nailed that impression down. So watch what price you pay to get in the door I guess.
Do I think there were creative ways to get Shady to an audience? Maybe? Esp if it had been the first single and gotten the tv performance slots BTIKM- but I have depressing doubts that (3years ago) Adam (as opposed to straight, married soon to be sleaze Thicke) could have gotten the same positive open arms reaction to a funk song about cruising. As his first follow up to FYE and the AMA memory (a first single about overt sexuality), both radio and tv might have balked. And as the second single, without the magic variables I mentioned up top, an out of left field genre had less chance of getting played on radio after BTIKM underperformed. In any event, I can see the label being wary - it would have taken vision, courage and risk taking by everyone.
Random Runnin' comment. JMHO but I kind of think if Adam liked Runnin' he would sing it - if he doesn't like the album arrangement that's easily remedied. I too like the song a lot but it does sound like an older pop/rock track. For GNT tour, Adam put bonus tracks front and center (wisely imo) - I think he would have done same with Runnin' if he wanted - but again who knows what might be in play there for Adam.
I know we like to feel we have definitive answers but really we have heartfelt speculation and that's fun too. (Hey, there are already decisions with this era I'm puzzled by - but I as much as it bugs me sometimes (a lot lol), I do try to remember that I don't know what discussions/opportunities have (or have not) been on the table.)
ETA: Yeah, I don't think the idea that young girls wouldn't sing along is a factor. I'm not sure if the issue is sexual content or orientation, but I don't think young girls care that he's gay and as for sex/gender - they sang along with Blurred Lines, 99 Problems, Get Lucky, S&M (so good) and (my fave) Talking Body-- I like to sing along with that one and realized just in time one day with passengers that was not a good idea lol.
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Post by csquared on Dec 12, 2015 0:05:18 GMT -5
But Uptown Funk is 2015. And the Robin Thicke thing hit in 2014? Or late 2013? Shady was at least a year ahead of its time. Unfortunately. I don't think "Shady" would have been a hit single in 2012, 2013, 2014 or 2015. The live performance is fun, it is an excellent album track, but nothing indicates it is anything more than a fan favorite. If it was something more (like Cuckoo and Runnin') it would have more streams and more iTunes sales. Here are the US iTunes numbers for "Shady": It is not in the Top 100 Adam tracks on iTunes (based on popularity bars). It is the #8 of 15 tracks on the Trespassing Deluxe Album (based on popularity bars). [It is close to tied with PTL.] Non-singles that are above it in sales: Cuckoo, Runnin', OOL, Underneath -- plus the 3 singles BTIKM, NCOE, Trespassing. I sort of wish I had not looked. My personal favorite track from the album is #15 -- the other Lambert-Mendez-Sparro collaboration, "Broken English." I am probably the only one here who loves that song and plays it regularly. Thanks Q3. I like Broken English too. But one of my favorites from Trespassing (and I know I've mentioned this several times here, haha) is Take Back. I love Adam's up-front vocal and the lyrics really hit home with me. I remember in some interview he said that was the first song he did for the album.
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Post by Q3 on Dec 12, 2015 0:19:51 GMT -5
I really do see your point Q3, but I do think 18 yr old girls would have loved singing Shady in the car on the way home - Turn it up, turn it up, turn it way up, don't stop the beat. And if I go by my three nieces, trouble is what they want. Lyrics aside, Shady is a funk-soul dance song just like Uptown Funk and listeners were ready for it. The song was serviced to radio as well as being picked up on streaming media. It got promo just like any other single, with the benefit of having Bruno Mars involved which gave it immediate visibility. Shady released on the original album timeline when everyone was really interested in what Adam would produce and before the album was corrupted by a late weird release of BTIKM, just might have hit that same sweet spot. And as far as songs being tested, we have to remember who was testing those songs. RCA was not going to give Adam a sexy dance song, just too plain scared. We will never know unless he tells us what Adam would have chosen for a first single, my guess would be Trespassing, but never BTIKM or NCOE. I think he has made that abundantly clear. On "Shady" we will have to agree to disagree. "Shady" is too complex for the easy, fast recall that characterizes hit music. Interestingly, another Adam fan favorite "Sleepwalker" has a very similar level of sonic and lyrical complexity. On "Shady", maybe if you cut out about 50% of the lyrics and then repeat "Turn it up, turn it up, turn it way up, don't stop the beat." a dozen times and increase the BPM and remove all that vocal layering they put on the album track you might have a single that would garner a lot of pop radio airplay. But it would be a different song. To illustrate, these are the lyrics to "Shady": Baby, I'm on the hunt Baby, I got my target on you Trouble, that's what I want And I'm gonna do Just what I have to Get your ass down to the front Go on and roll it out, I dare you Sorry I'm kinda drunk But did you just say your game was brand new
No, I ain't broken, but I need a fix That satisfaction when I, I get my kicks I'm up all night, I'm outta sight Don't turn on the light 'Cause I'm feeling so shady lately Come on and take me underground Deep under the street Come on and take me, take me down Where freaks like us can meet
Turn it up, turn it up, turn it up Turn it way up, don't stop the beat Come on and turn me, turn me out 'Cause I'm feeling so shady lately
Gonna go and get me a shot Gonna knock it back, forget all my blues Yeah, that really hits the spot I'm feeling pretty fierce in my dancin' shoes
No, I ain't broken, but I need a fix That satisfaction when I get my kicks I'm up all night, I'm outta sight Don't turn on the light 'Cause I'm feeling so shady lately Come on and take me underground Deep under the street Come on and take me, take me down Where freaks like us can meet
Turn it up, turn it up, turn it up Turn it way up, don't stop the beat Come on and turn me, turn me out 'Cause I'm feeling so shady lately
I throw more shade than a cloudy day The brakes don't work, I'm just a runaway train Somebody come and help me out, All I wanna be is free I was tryin' to get down, now I can't get out I'm shady lately
Come on and take me underground Deep under the street Come on and take me, take me down Where freaks like us can meet Turn it up, turn it up, turn it up Turn it way up, don't stop the beat Come on and turn me, turn me out 'Cause I'm feeling so shady lately
Shady latelyI color coded all the parts that are dueling for recall. What is the hook, where is the bridge, what is the main message of the song? >> Think of WWFM which is not my favorite song to listen to but I can see why it is popular -- hear it once and you can sing along, the message is universal, and it is beautifully sung/produced. 6 years later, it is still a crowd-pleaser live. Let me contrast "Shady" with a near-perfect pop song that Adam wrote (and the damn well better be a single) -- The Original High. It not only has a really strong hook, it has that gorgeous bridge. And the lyrics are upbeat. Like "Uptown Funk", TOH fuses EDM and Disco -- and it also uses Adam voice. "The Original High" lyrics[Verse 1] I got the need for speedin' on a hot night Pushing one hundred and fifty just to get a rise There's no comfort in comfort, I need the edge But the edge keeps drifting, it's all in my head
[Pre-Chorus] Ooh, remember back in Hollywood The medication flowing through my veins was you Yeah, the summer back in Hollywood The medication, medication
[Chorus 1] Just let me feel the rush like the first night Wanna breathe it out cause I'm going out my mind Gotta feel the touch like the first time Cause I'm chasing the original high Chasing the original high Chasing the original high Chasing the original high Chasing the original high
[Verse 2] I'm tryna buy a fix but there ain't no price I try to feed the hunger that keeps me up at night We were on a trip, tryna replicate But the highs I hit just ain't doin it for me
[Pre-Chorus] [Chorus 2] Just let me feel the rush like the first night Wanna breathe it out cause I'm going out my mind Gotta feel the touch like the first time Cause I'm chasing the original high Chasing the original high Chasing the original high Chasing the original high
[Bridge] Yeah-eah-eah Summertime it stays on my mind Cause you and me are alive inside Summertime is stuck on my mind Summertime it stays on my mind Cause you and me never die inside Summertime is stuck on my mind
Chasing the original high High High High High So high!
[Chorus 1]
IMO TOH is the best thing Adam has ever written and recorded. My hope it is the single for Summer 2016 because it is a song that needs to be heard by many, many people.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2015 0:24:22 GMT -5
Weather channel shows upper 40's for a low and good chance of rain, that is cold for us sunbelt folks. That's down right balmy for us in the north - I'll take the rain over snow any day. This time last year Buffalo was closed down due to record breaking snowfall Trust me when I say, anything under 60 will feel cold for our California guy! ❤️
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Post by Jablea on Dec 12, 2015 0:25:47 GMT -5
"Shady" was never intended for and was not written for pop radio. It was not even one of the four tracks they tested for single #2 which included Adam's picks: Cuckoo, Naked Love, Trespassing and NCOE. NCOE was the only track that had any interest from radio programmers and that was partly because Bruno Mars wrote it -- and he was the biggest artist in the world in 2013-2014. Question. If I remember you had an contact that knew they tested the four tracks on Trespassing. Is that because the label had no confidence? From TOH it seems that Warner didn't bother to test anything, they knew which one. Perhaps because of Max Martin? Just wondering your take on how radio "testing" was different for the two albums.
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Post by Jablea on Dec 12, 2015 0:30:26 GMT -5
FURCA there I said it....hahaha you know, that's one thing about the song that has seemed clear. "there I said it" is usually the statement you make right after you tell someone FU for the first time after keeping your anger bottled up for a long time.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2015 0:33:38 GMT -5
The hook in Shady is obvious to me! It's the "Turn it up turn it turn it way up! Cuz I'm feeling so Shady lately!" Great sing along part! Hand in the air, finger pointing up! You know, like we do when Adam does it live at concerts! ETA: I never believed RCA actually tested the 4 tracks with a big enough sampling of PDs. And, IMO, the proof is 1) If they had, then the chosen one, NCOE, would have gotten played! And 2) We now know a lot more about what was happening with RCA and Adam then, and the politics. He pretty much said in the UK Metro, they did not pick the singles he wanted. Although, it was kind of obvious seeing as they picked 2 of only 3 songs he did not write! :(
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Post by Jablea on Dec 12, 2015 0:38:16 GMT -5
I hope I'm still around when Adam writes his autobiography. He will have so many stories to tell. We'll finally know the real story behind the Trespassing debacle, the many loves of his life, backstage secrets, and so much more. I am having the time of my life following him and his career. He's fascinating, he's a quality human being, and he's talented beyond belief. I'm so glad to be able to share my passion. And he loved his grandma. Perfect. Yeppers. That's why I'm still fascinated almost seven years later. That and hanging out with you and everyone here at Atop.
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